Boycott McDonalds

Erudite · #1 07-03-2008, 10:05 AM

We had another thread on letting TV stations know that we don't approve of some of their programming. What do you think of this?

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It's a fairly easy thing for our family since we've been to McDs like once in the past year, so I don't know that my not going there would have an impact, but I figured if I passed on the info, maybe it would have an impact. Ford motor Co. has been under a boycott for over a year for the same reason and are fading fast....

**5ft Diva** · #2 07-03-2008, 04:04 PM

Interesting.... Does boycotting McD's really send the message that we don't support them supporting gay and lesbian agendas or does it send the message that we're trying to be healthy?

I'm not sure if the message will get through. What are your thoughts?

bookworm · #3 07-03-2008, 06:04 PM

Well, from my point of view, I don't support gay marriage, so I don't want to spend my money with a corporation who is going to use some of those profits (from my money) in supporting gay marriage. Whether they get that message or not, my money is not funneling into a political agenda that I don't support.

But you have a good point. It would be nice if we could all just boycott fatty foods, huh? But I just love them so much!

**5ft Diva** · #4 07-05-2008, 04:28 PM

Huh? I'm not talking about boycotting fatty foods at all...I think my point was missed. I must not have explained myself very well. Oh, well.

Erudite · #5 07-07-2008, 10:18 AM

Well, BOTH are good reasons to not go to McDs. I suppose a note to them telling them that you are boycotting them for a reason would help the issue.

Mamallama · #6 07-10-2008, 01:59 AM

I think it’s great to be discussing ways to stand up for what is right.
These are great thoughts, but I’ll tell you why I choose not to boycott---I hope you won’t all be picketing out front of my house after I tell you why…..

Maybe I’m way off base----I do have a bit of a liberal side----this is how I feel.
I feel that one of the biggest reasons that Ford and McDonald’s support Gay Marriage is because they don’t want to discriminate against their employees and this is a way for them to show that they will take care of all of their employees, no matter what their religious, political, ethinicity or disablility may be. I believe these companies also put money into Special Olympics, civil rights agendas and so forth.

I was reading this morning in Alma 30:7-8 “Now there was no law against a man’s belief; for it was strictly contrary to the commands of God that there should be a law which should bring men on to unequal grounds. For thus saith the scripture: Choose ye this day, whom ye will serve.”
I was struck by the thought while reading, that we need to be careful to not cross the line of not allowing people to believe differently than we believe. This country was founded upon this principle. This principle is a founding principle that allowed the gospel to be restored in this land.

My husband worked for Ford for 18 years. While we had no control over what political agenda the Ford Family has, I was proud of the fact that Ford gave the same insurance benefits to the domestic partner of one of my dh’s co-workers as I received being the wife of an employee. Yes this man was gay, and had lived with his partner for 14 years. I strongly feel that this was rightly so that he was given insurance benefits. These men made a commitment to one another, lived together for as long as my husband and I had lived together------ is it fair for Ford to not give them insurance benefits because their belief and lifestyle is different than ours? I think we are discriminating against homosexuals by denying them benefits for choosing a different lifestyle than we choose to live.
Ford could choose to not give my dh and I benefits because we are Mormon…..because they don’t believe Joseph Smith saw God, to others that claim is considered blasphemous, or they could hold it against us that our religion once practiced plural marriage which is against the law…..but no, the company does not hold our religious beliefs and lifestyle against me and my dh. We received benefits just as all other employees did.

Don’t get me wrong. I do believe that marriage is ordained of God to be between a man and a woman. However, I will not discriminate against those that believe differently. I would like to see the definition of marriage preserved and perhaps a different term used for those who are gay wishing to commit to their partner.
However, I’m not going to cry and scream and fret if those in that position do use the term marriage. I will continue to teach my children that marriage is sacred and that God taught us it should be between a man and a woman. But I also teach my children to love and accept those that believe differently. If my next door neighbors happen to be a lesbian couple, I will still be friends. I will still bake them cookies. And if they invite me to their wedding, I will attend. I will not march outside their place of employment saying they should not be allowed to work there or receive benefits because they want to use the term marriage.

I will not be boycotting Ford and McDonalds.

I boycott or 'stand up' for my beliefs, simply by not watching television, all the bad programming that I disagree with…and by writing letters to the writers and producers and TV stations, or advertisers to try to make my voice heard...The majority of what we watch are DVD’s. I won’t be turning the TV back on until clean programming begins to surface again. If that never happens, there are plenty of good programs on DVDs to keep us occupied.

Okay, I’m bracing myself for an attack….what do you think?

***Big_Sissy*** · #7 07-10-2008, 02:29 AM

I think you have put a great deal of thought into this, and I salute your efforts in backing up why you believe and do what you do.

I have a similar situation. I work with a woman that 2 weeks ago was married in CA to her long time girl friend. I just happened to be on-site the week before this went down, and they passed a card around asking if we would like to sign it. I thought long and hard about what I was going to do -- should I boycott the signing of the card? After all I do not agree with or condone that particular California law, nor do I condone that life style.

However, I try to not be a person that judges my neighbor (heaven only knows I don't want to be judged either), and decided long ago that I'd leave the judging to higher heavenly powers. Now I'm not perfect by any means, but I'm trying.

Now, this co-worker is someone I work very closely with, and actually quite adore, despite her lifestyle. I decided that I cared more for her as a person that I abhored her lifestyle and signed the card. In the end, she actually sent me an email thanking me for not judging her, and for looking beyond my own beliefs to still show her I cared for her even though she knows I do not support her lifestyle (all my co-workers know I'm LDS). I truly feel that was the correct decision, and I felt good about my decision. After all she is STILL a child of God despite her choices; the same way an alcoholic or anyone else that lives in sin is -- and that would include all of us.

I believe you also bring up a very valid point in that a boycott doesn't just affect those at the top, but it affect everyone involved, including the good people.

Love the person, in spite of their sins (easier said than done, I know).

So I guess the real question is what are better ways to show we don't support these types of actions? I suppose, just from my own postulation, that sending letters/emails is probably a better alternative???

Erudite · #8 07-10-2008, 08:48 AM

No attack from this quarter, ML. I'm glad you and BS said what you did, it gives us all a lot to think about. I guess the difference for me is the money issue. I don't want to feel like my money is used to support issues that I believe to be directly contrary to what is right, even though I would also bake cookies for a neighbor living a different lifestyle than me (and have done so). For me, it is a different thing to put money there, because I have no control over what happens to my money once it is there. I often say that one of the reasons I'm glad to shop at DI is the fact that I know what they do with their money.

I am SO sorry that it affects the little guy...probably more than it actually affects the guys on top in the financial sense since they have the ability to protect themselves... however it doesn't change the fact that I don't want my support, even by something so indirect as making a purchase, to go to a company that openly supports an agenda in which I can not believe. It is a sad truth in this country that money talks...not morality.

bookworm · #9 07-10-2008, 11:12 AM

I'm with Erudite- it's about $$ for me. I think as a consumer, that's my right- to decide what companies I support with my money. I'm not judging those people who are gay~ I'm not sending them money for their causes, though.

In response to the "little guy" argument- in a capitalist economy (which is what the USA is) the consumers aren't responsible for the "little guys"- I don't feel obligated to shop somewhere primarily to keep their employees employed- I can't live that way. I shop based on product value, price and need (or want) AND whether I want to support that company. I don't buy products put out by Playboy, or eat at Hooters.

Unfortunately, we are all affected by the good or bad decisions of those at the top of the companies we work for. That's the way it goes. It can appear unfortunate if someone views themselves as victims of the system, but the system does work- it's what has made our country the greatest in the world- and it is what gives every one, little guy or big guy, the opportunity to be and do anything they want. We aren't limited by what our bosses do, unless we decide to give them that power.

And if someone were to refuse to give rights to someone based on religious reasons, as you mentioned, that would be unconstitutional. Homosexuality is NOT a religion, however.

I hope you don't feel attacked. A healthy exchange of ideas (also known as a disagreement) is what this country is all about!!

I have a brother who is gay and I adore him. I don't judge him. I also don't try to influence him to change his beliefs to align themselves with mine and fortunately, he doesn't do that to me either, so it's all good.

**5ft Diva** · #10 07-10-2008, 11:55 AM

This is a great topic, E. Thanks for bringing it up. I really appreciate the two different views being presented here. Not because I'm trying to pick a side, but because it literally saves me from being ignorant. Thank you, thank you, thank you all for your honest and candid opinions about this subject. It also helps me "practice" hearing another's views w/ a mature and healthy attitude.

I like the idea of writing to the company. If I could I would make an appointment w/ the president and sit down w/ him and share my concerns, but that's me.

Mamallama · #11 07-10-2008, 12:42 PM

Let me go back and edit my other post taking out the part about us losing money was actually meant as a side note. That wasn't even my point at all!!
I agree that where we put our money does speak.

My point is that I also think it is great when companies treat their employees of diverse backgrounds equally. I think McDonald's donation and what they are doing is a statement showing their support of all people. They donate to many many other groups and causes as well, some of which I support, and some of which I probably don't support----But overall, I support the fact that McDonald's is trying to be good to all groups of people, trying to treat all with respect.

That's all I was really trying to say.

Erudite · #12 07-10-2008, 01:01 PM

Well said, ML! It is a good point that discrimination should not occur based on beliefs or color or religion or sex. Companies should not do that to employees, and the McDonalds boycott was careful to say that their boycott had nothing to do with employees or customers of McDonalds who choose gay or lesbian lifestyles. It had everything to do with McDonalds supporting causes that seek to make those lifestyles mainstream and equivalent to the divinely ordained family structure.

I am also of the opinion that diverse backgrounds, something usually difficult to change, is one thing, but lifestyle choices (and the portrayal of those choices in TV programs) that are morally incorrect is another and we need to be heard in opposition to them. Is it possible that we devalue our beliefs when we, even indirectly, support those who would seek to destroy them?

Mamallama · #13 07-10-2008, 01:38 PM

Good point ER, yes that's possible....but then where do we draw the line when it seems that most of the media out there supports in one way or another lifestyles contrary to our own?

If we feel that way, perhaps we had better not watch any TV, any DVD's read books or magazines, listen to music or watch the news--because there are so many different beliefs and agendas out there that the owners of publishing companies, television companies, newspaper companies, etc...etc...have, that we could be indirectly supporting, promoting lifestyles different to what we believe, that we may as well go live in compounds like other certain religions do, if we feel that we are devaluing our own values by living, eating, reading driving, listening to news, music that is produced by people who support different agendas than our own.

I don't believe that God wants us to live in a bubble. We protect our homes and families as best as we can, try and share the gospel with those around us, but we cannot force it on others. We need to stand up for our beliefs, but I believe we can do it in a kind and gentle way. We have to live in a world with opposing values, viewpoints, and 'agendas' than what we have and believe in. It is all part of the plan. I think it's how we relate and treat those with differing values that will make the difference. And if we can one by one be kind and loving to those around us, setting good examples of our values and beliefs without being forceful, maybe the world will gradually change one by one into a better, more loving kind place, with more loving, kind people with good moral values.

Thanks for bringing up the topic ER and for putting up with me spouting off my random thoughts! Really we do need to be careful of what we are supporting. I do believe that.

***Big_Sissy*** · #14 07-10-2008, 02:03 PM

I just have a thought. Television makes money from Beer commercials, some restaurants make money from alcohol sales. We certainly don't support that in the least, but do some of us (not you ML) still watch the tube, and some of us still eat at restaurants that sell alcohol, even though we don't actually buy the alcohol?

I suppose the restaurant example is easier to see why it's still probably fine since we don't actually buy the alcohol, but the TV is rampant with absolute filth from the commercials (beer and most everything else) to the actual programming. So what's the difference between that and supporting/not supporting with our money a company like mcdonalds?

I believe in the end the choice is still a very personal one, but this is very stimulating conversation, and I'm interested in your opinions.

Erudite · #15 07-10-2008, 04:05 PM

Bubble compounds...hmmm. Well, as one who has gotten rid of the TV channels, doesn't get a newspaper, is careful about what kinds of movies do make it into the home, but still manages to keep up on what's going on in the world, in point of fact it is possible...and even nice. I don't control every dollar that goes out of my wallet nor do I know that it goes to bad or good most of the time, though I'm trying to be more informed. I daresay that is the one of the issues in this discussion, that we learn about the world around us, both so that we can protect our families from it and influence it for good or be an example for good...without force. I don't think choosing to buy a different product and letting a company know that you've done so is in fact force, though.

The tough part is that we aren't all as vocal as we need to be...they call us the silent majority for a reason. And those with louder voices and more money somehow seem more convincing to the fence-sitters out there, and those with the loud voices are not generally altruistic.

On the restaurant and alcohol issue...Have you noticed that Macey's no longer sells tobacco products? I thought that was cool of them. It does promote a healthy lifestyle. I already do most of my shopping there, so it's easy to continue to support them.

Dia Minha · #16 07-10-2008, 05:40 PM

Yes, Maceys did stop selling tobaco products. But even before that they have always been closed on Sunday. My DH and I recommitted to buying all our groceries at Maceys, because of this fact. I just loved it when they gave us another reason for our 100% tried and true support. We also buy anything we can at Liddiards for the same reason and search for ways to support other companies that are closed on Sunday.

I have been very tempted to get multiple copies of the Sunday paper for the coupons. However, when I think about having someone else work on Sunday so that I can have my extra coupons, I just can't do it. I believe the Sabbath should be kept holy and not only should I keep it holy myself, but support and help others that do the same.

I'm not trying to get off topic here. All of your posts just made me think of the ways I support my believes, by strongly supporting companies that uphold those same values.

natickgirl · #17 07-11-2008, 07:46 PM

I have really enjoyed reading your thoughts, and I appreciate the different perspectives. (I would make a TERRIBLE judge because I can always see the validity of both sides' arguments.) I have strong feelings about some of these issues, but I'm too tired to make any sense of them right now. Maybe I'll post later....

**5ft Diva** · #18 07-12-2008, 01:20 AM

Macey's stopped selling tobacco products? Wow, I didn't know that!

Dia Minha · #19 07-12-2008, 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 5ft Diva

Macey's stopped selling tobacco products? Wow, I didn't know that!

Yep they did. Cool huh?

I saw a representive on the news. They talked about how they wanted to support a healthier lifestyles. They mentioned that there are a lot of people in Utah that smoke and most of those want to quit. They wanted to help those people, by giving them a place to shop where they were not tempted to buy tobacco products. Man I love Maceys!

I was thinking a little bit after I posted last, about all the reasons I love Maceys so much. Of course because they are closed on Sunday and maybe it is for that reason that the atmosphere there is just so pleasant. I feel good in their store. There is a completely different spirit there than at like Walmart or Albertsons. We have kind of talked about this before Diva. I seem to be very sensitive to these types of things. Which really is a blessing, but can seem like a trial sometimes. Especially when everyone else is getting boxes of cereal for $.50 and I can't bare to walk into Albertsons. The only time I have gone to Albertsons in the last year, was because our banks only location in Tooele is in Albertsons.

I know that my family and I have been very blessed because of our choices that seem hard at the time. I know we have received blessing for supporting Maceys. I may pay more for groceries, but I get an aweful lot in return. In sounds kind of silly to say I have a testimony of shopping at Maceys, but I do. Right after DH and I were married there was a talk in general conference about keeping the Sabbath Day holy. The speaker (I'll have to look him up again) talked about an apostle or general authority going all the way across town to shop at a store that was closed on Sunday. I knew right then and there that we needed to do the same.

Anyway, now that I am completely of subject . . .

Stargazer · #20 07-19-2008, 08:26 PM

While we certainly do not live in a bubble or compound we are counseled to live in the world but not of the world. I'm impressed by Erudites efforts because she's making specific choices to follow that counsel. I find it easy to get swayed into living of the world.

I have talked in our gospel doctrine classes recently about being a voice for what we believe. Those who make the most noise in our country are generally not those who agree with our beliefs. If we don't raise our voices then there will be no one opposing those loud voices.

I don't consider myself to be discriminatory (although I'm sure there are those that would) but I do have real issues with those who are seeking rights based on sexual preferences. And as a group they are very vocal. I agree that they are children of God. One of them is my brother and I think he's awesome. But if I have a testimony of the gospel I need to stand true to it in all cases. I don't think it's easy and I do think that it requires thoughtfulness. But we shouldn't be afraid to stand up for what we believe. Our examples should be Ammon, Aaron, Omni & Himner, Abinadi, Samuel the Lamanite. . . They risked their lives to stand up for truth and preached it loudly! Will we justify ourselves and keep quiet soo as not to hurt feelings and help others feel ok? Or will we figure out how to have charity and still be a voice of truth. I'm not saying I'm awesome at this, but it's what I believe we are taught to do.